canibalbranco
Member
It is easier to criticize than to build something,
Especially at a time like this.
Bring solutions is the right thing to do now.
Especially at a time like this.
Bring solutions is the right thing to do now.
Losing faith in DRK
- Thread starter BelStar
- Start date
First of , it is (was) August, big summer break, people go on holidays without telling anybody,
so i guess it is/was slow out there, and now after the summer we will get back on track ! ....>
For the post by Belstar !
And there we go again !!
Sorry to say, but i heard and read these issues many times before, in open threads (like here) or in closed conversations !
As far as i understand BelStar he is NOT hustling/expecting the Dev Team for new versions and Developments all the time,
he is concerned regarding the the Actual State of the Development !
I can not say much to that, as I am never on Jira (and would not understand it anyway) or the code and such !
I hope you guys from the Dev Team/ Staff Members take his concerns seriously, as we should. For me as a non technical person (sure i trust evan) K Atlas is working through that code and whatever does not make sense or will not work he will point out as his name is as much in it as 'ours'.
(so i believe/hope that is all good)
the only thing i can say to this is: "deadline and rush developments for RC ...."
you kidding me, who care ! The FUD will be out there anyway, we need solid products (DRK, DS+, MN's...), if they takes weeks longer to finnish, who cares, send an update to your community and they will stand 100% behind you Evan, it is that easy !!!
My big concern in this (and this thread ) is the answers from the (only) Dev Team members who answered to this
fernando and @verteo (sorry guys, i do NOT wanna in any way attack you or put you on the sport, but this is just the perfect example !
I tried to have this conversation in private many times over !!)
- verteo totally agrees with belstar
(Well observed and well researched. I couldnt agree more.
It mainly breaks down that the development team in no way listens to the community and this is really poor. And where is our community lead anyways? Even for me it's hard to follow what's going on behind the scenes.)
- fernando plays it off as it is no big deal at all ! (Sorry man, but that is just not enough !!!)
asking for the Dev Team members his answer is pretty much , yes they are around and busy
.... maybe InternetApe is, I'm not sure
..... CHAOSiTEC doesn't engage much
.....@eltito is not missing, he posts here sometimes
So what is this telling us !?
The communication between the Dev Team and the community is BROKEN !!
half of all problems and concedes posted here or on btctalk are because of this ! There is nobody out there to communicate to the community !
Eltito started to be the 'communicator' for 2 posts and then disappeared ! what is that, well ether you take the job or you do not, and if you do (as you did) , well then do it or pass it onto somebody else). Sorry but that is just as unprofessional as it comes !
"communication campaign he talked about has not been done because, as you point, the launch of RC4"
these 2 things have nothing to do with each other ! Press releases get send out by any company who builds something new ! Specially after a complicated launch (RC4), use that to ensure the community and investors (with facts) that everything is being taken care off !
Can we PLEASE sort this out and get somebody (on the inside /Dev Team) to be the Communicator to the outside (us the community) !!!
(best would be if it is a new person who is not in the Dev Team !)
- DS+
we as the DRK Community are conceded to use/try Darksend + ! (read the posts above and check on btctalk)
well, why would anybody outside our community even attempt to use it if we (the professionals) are worried about it !
- I have no idea, why it got released so early ? (if it was supposedly not 100%)
- why are there no official updates on the wallets and DS+ (YES it is working/ NO it is not working please hold on/ Yes it is working but only in setting x/ No it ......)
(the wallet and DS+ are the biggest concerns for anybody in this crypto world, as it hold your coins, and the last thing you wanna do is loose these coins !!! .... so shouldn't we work on this issues first and with full steam !?)
- Darkcoin foundation
sure it 'leaked' out to btctalk ! everything leaks out , as the community is so desperate for news and communication !
this is NOTHING new, we know that since for ever and discussed it many times over !
What is the way to do ? Well post it before here on drktalk where it belongs ! has nothing to do with hype, it is just a news update for the community and whoever wants to listen:
"Darkcoin Foundation will be launched in Texas with team members ..... due to ......."
and everybody happy ! Done ! why make a 'secret' out of it or do it behind closed curtains ? you give one update to the community and done, everybody knows what will come and you can do whatever you want in the background again.
- MN Payments
well same old story. (i am will to getting involved in the technical side of this as you guys know much better what is what)
BUT just how it was done,.... Evan comments on btctalk and the whole fuzz is out and about !
Same thing, avoid the fuzz, make a "Development Update" and it is done and official. The kids on btctalk are peeing themselves every time something like that goes around , when did you hear that, where was that posted,.....>> cut through the crab, make it official and done coming from HERE !!
- Community in general
https://darkcointalk.org/threads/good-read-and-good-time-to-buy.2207/
"However, examining certain aspects of the Darkcoin ecosystem–such as community interaction, developer attentiveness, and exchange liquidity–provides investors with a broad snapshot of the present state and future outlook of the Darkcoin price. CoinGecko’s comprehensive coin metric analysis algorithm ranks Darkcoin 6th. Darkcoin earns a 71% developer score, a 53% exchange liquidity score, and a 40% community interaction score, which averages out to a 55% comprehensive metric score."
That is it !
read it again, we are doing so WELL (coin 70%/ Dev 53%, .... but our community interaction score is 40%)
We need a "Communicator between the Dev Team and the Community"
(updates, concerns, community spirit,....)
Again: it is NOT about coming up with NEW things all the time, it is about communicating to your community what is actually going on (NO HYPE in that !)
otherwise we are killing off our own community !
If the Dev Team does not talk to us and tells us what is happening, why would we care about all of this !
Come on ....>>
so i guess it is/was slow out there, and now after the summer we will get back on track ! ....>
For the post by Belstar !
And there we go again !!
Sorry to say, but i heard and read these issues many times before, in open threads (like here) or in closed conversations !
As far as i understand BelStar he is NOT hustling/expecting the Dev Team for new versions and Developments all the time,
he is concerned regarding the the Actual State of the Development !
I can not say much to that, as I am never on Jira (and would not understand it anyway) or the code and such !
I hope you guys from the Dev Team/ Staff Members take his concerns seriously, as we should. For me as a non technical person (sure i trust evan) K Atlas is working through that code and whatever does not make sense or will not work he will point out as his name is as much in it as 'ours'.
(so i believe/hope that is all good)
the only thing i can say to this is: "deadline and rush developments for RC ...."
you kidding me, who care ! The FUD will be out there anyway, we need solid products (DRK, DS+, MN's...), if they takes weeks longer to finnish, who cares, send an update to your community and they will stand 100% behind you Evan, it is that easy !!!
My big concern in this (and this thread ) is the answers from the (only) Dev Team members who answered to this
fernando and @verteo (sorry guys, i do NOT wanna in any way attack you or put you on the sport, but this is just the perfect example !
I tried to have this conversation in private many times over !!)
- verteo totally agrees with belstar
(Well observed and well researched. I couldnt agree more.
It mainly breaks down that the development team in no way listens to the community and this is really poor. And where is our community lead anyways? Even for me it's hard to follow what's going on behind the scenes.)
- fernando plays it off as it is no big deal at all ! (Sorry man, but that is just not enough !!!)
asking for the Dev Team members his answer is pretty much , yes they are around and busy
.... maybe InternetApe is, I'm not sure
..... CHAOSiTEC doesn't engage much
.....@eltito is not missing, he posts here sometimes
So what is this telling us !?
The communication between the Dev Team and the community is BROKEN !!
half of all problems and concedes posted here or on btctalk are because of this ! There is nobody out there to communicate to the community !
Eltito started to be the 'communicator' for 2 posts and then disappeared ! what is that, well ether you take the job or you do not, and if you do (as you did) , well then do it or pass it onto somebody else). Sorry but that is just as unprofessional as it comes !
"communication campaign he talked about has not been done because, as you point, the launch of RC4"
these 2 things have nothing to do with each other ! Press releases get send out by any company who builds something new ! Specially after a complicated launch (RC4), use that to ensure the community and investors (with facts) that everything is being taken care off !
Can we PLEASE sort this out and get somebody (on the inside /Dev Team) to be the Communicator to the outside (us the community) !!!
(best would be if it is a new person who is not in the Dev Team !)
- DS+
we as the DRK Community are conceded to use/try Darksend + ! (read the posts above and check on btctalk)
well, why would anybody outside our community even attempt to use it if we (the professionals) are worried about it !
- I have no idea, why it got released so early ? (if it was supposedly not 100%)
- why are there no official updates on the wallets and DS+ (YES it is working/ NO it is not working please hold on/ Yes it is working but only in setting x/ No it ......)
(the wallet and DS+ are the biggest concerns for anybody in this crypto world, as it hold your coins, and the last thing you wanna do is loose these coins !!! .... so shouldn't we work on this issues first and with full steam !?)
- Darkcoin foundation
sure it 'leaked' out to btctalk ! everything leaks out , as the community is so desperate for news and communication !
this is NOTHING new, we know that since for ever and discussed it many times over !
What is the way to do ? Well post it before here on drktalk where it belongs ! has nothing to do with hype, it is just a news update for the community and whoever wants to listen:
"Darkcoin Foundation will be launched in Texas with team members ..... due to ......."
and everybody happy ! Done ! why make a 'secret' out of it or do it behind closed curtains ? you give one update to the community and done, everybody knows what will come and you can do whatever you want in the background again.
- MN Payments
well same old story. (i am will to getting involved in the technical side of this as you guys know much better what is what)
BUT just how it was done,.... Evan comments on btctalk and the whole fuzz is out and about !
Same thing, avoid the fuzz, make a "Development Update" and it is done and official. The kids on btctalk are peeing themselves every time something like that goes around , when did you hear that, where was that posted,.....>> cut through the crab, make it official and done coming from HERE !!
- Community in general
https://darkcointalk.org/threads/good-read-and-good-time-to-buy.2207/
"However, examining certain aspects of the Darkcoin ecosystem–such as community interaction, developer attentiveness, and exchange liquidity–provides investors with a broad snapshot of the present state and future outlook of the Darkcoin price. CoinGecko’s comprehensive coin metric analysis algorithm ranks Darkcoin 6th. Darkcoin earns a 71% developer score, a 53% exchange liquidity score, and a 40% community interaction score, which averages out to a 55% comprehensive metric score."
That is it !
read it again, we are doing so WELL (coin 70%/ Dev 53%, .... but our community interaction score is 40%)
We need a "Communicator between the Dev Team and the Community"
(updates, concerns, community spirit,....)
Again: it is NOT about coming up with NEW things all the time, it is about communicating to your community what is actually going on (NO HYPE in that !)
otherwise we are killing off our own community !
If the Dev Team does not talk to us and tells us what is happening, why would we care about all of this !
Come on ....>>
recan86
Member
You know what calms a group of high testosterone guys down? An attractive woman who understands what she's talking about and impresses you (the man) while she does it. Get a few woman in and have them interview for the job to talk to the community, Be a face no one wants to be mad at. As a result, the development team just bought them a little more time. That maybe a little sexist but the levels of testosterone are becoming a little high.
People are excited but impatient. I always linger around these forums and if I have a problem I offer a solution otherwise I stay out of the way. I haven't lost faith in Drk but I am wondering if the community is turning on its Captain like a mutiny on a ship away to long at sea in the 1500s. Anyone can go on this forum and say "this is how it should be done" but honestly who are you if your not providing a solution for a problem? Lets try to remember that we are adults. We all have alternate lives behind these machines and for most its our passion that drives us in this community. Some of you are angry because you spent money and right now you could possibly be negative your initial investment. ... What's the number one rule in crypto? Don't spend what you are not willing to loose.
Give a little bit a break to some of these guys.
I get that we all want a steady stream of information coming at us preferably every other day or even weekly but being impatient will only cause errors and anger in a community that isn't even a year old. Consider the fact that everyone in here can read what we are saying to each other and if they loose confidence in the community itself then we loose everything. Doesn't matter what the product is if the consumer doesn't care to walk into the store.
People are excited but impatient. I always linger around these forums and if I have a problem I offer a solution otherwise I stay out of the way. I haven't lost faith in Drk but I am wondering if the community is turning on its Captain like a mutiny on a ship away to long at sea in the 1500s. Anyone can go on this forum and say "this is how it should be done" but honestly who are you if your not providing a solution for a problem? Lets try to remember that we are adults. We all have alternate lives behind these machines and for most its our passion that drives us in this community. Some of you are angry because you spent money and right now you could possibly be negative your initial investment. ... What's the number one rule in crypto? Don't spend what you are not willing to loose.
Give a little bit a break to some of these guys.
I get that we all want a steady stream of information coming at us preferably every other day or even weekly but being impatient will only cause errors and anger in a community that isn't even a year old. Consider the fact that everyone in here can read what we are saying to each other and if they loose confidence in the community itself then we loose everything. Doesn't matter what the product is if the consumer doesn't care to walk into the store.
Just a small clarification, I'm not part of the deav team... if I were then you should be worried because my coding skills are as bad as they get
Anyway, I'm gonna be a director in the foundation, so I guess I'm part of the team in a broader sense. By the way, the creation of the foundation was not leaked, it was Evan who posted the newspaper ad! The foundation had been talked many times before and Evan thought that it was a fun way to announce that it was finally started. There was no intention to keep it secret or anything. If there were it would not have been announced because one thing I'm sure... nobody reads the public notice section of the Asian American Times (the newspaper in which it was published). Ed Moncada, another director, has explained how it started (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg8589870#msg8589870). This is at a very early stage, that's why there have not been more information yet.Back to topic. I'm not trying to play off BelStar's concerns, what I said is that the project is at an early stage and people areh learning to work together. Of course, there are problems! we would not be here discussing if there weren't.
Regarding communication and the weekly announcement that eltito started, the problem is that most weeks there is no content, so it is not easy to do it. However, we should have at least one about the current state of RC4 and how it is working because clearly some people is worried about Darksend. In my experience it is mostly working, but there are issues that should be solved in RC5 (btw, Jira is super easy to use and you don't need to understand code to read around).
The easiest idea I have to improve communication is to always post at darkcointalk first. But we should also cross post to bitcointalk because there are people who care about Darkcoin that are only there.
As for Gecko's community score... As far as I know it is just a ratio that takes into account Twitter followers, Facebook likes and Reddit subscribers. It is very interesting, but it has little to do with our communication problem.
Last edited by a moderator:
moli
Well-known member
This is such a rambling post. You maybe have a valid point but what I see is you're either angry or trolling. Very much like most of the rambling, unorganized, nonsensical posts on BCT. Are you expecting your devs to do their job, and at the same time listen to all your whining and screaming?
Sure, I would love to see eltito to communicate more with you guys on BCT, or at least tell you guys to just shut up. But the threads on BCT always go so fast, if there were 5 community leaders designated to talk to you guys, their posts would still get lost after 10 minutes, because you guys would rather talk/type about all kinds of topics rather than listening to the dev team. There's no perfect software developers. Oh, and most of them don't talk, can't communicate effectively. But if you have a technical problem, they will be happy to help you.
Just a small clarification, I'm not part of the deav team... if I were then you should be worried because my coding skills are as bad as they get
My bet,
sorry to put you on the spot.
Lets hear from The Dev Team then what is going on !
(I hope Evan does not have to reply himself as he is/should be busy coding)
as you/we can see in this thread, the community has no idea who is actually involved in the Dev Team anymore.
"The easiest idea I have to improve communication is to always post at darkcointalk first."
we said and agreed on that again and again and again ... and it still is not happening or working !
"we should have at least one about the current state of RC4 and how it is working because clearly some people is worried about Darksend"
PLEASE !
"weekly announcement that eltito started, the problem is that most weeks there is no content"
sorry but i have to disagree, there are so many things going on all the time in DRK world, it would be great to summarize them once a week or every 2 weeks
(no hype in this), just a summery
- progress on RCx, Ideas for DarkTor, progress on OB implementation, Numbers up on FB, New Dev Team members or Old once gone, New Wallets design progress,
....>>
just my 2 cent of thought
moli
Well-known member
No, I am not calling you a troll. But we all should be grownups here. We should have reasonable expectations from others and more expectations from within ourselves. Only children would expect "gimme gimme"... but grownups should act differently. Darkcoin is still in beta, I don't think we should expect it to be perfect. Most of the people in the darkcoin team are volunteers who have other real life obligations and a family. They do the best they can to make this project work. The least the "community" can do is try to understand. I think this project is awesome, has the best team, has the best democratic, open policy where they let people participate in the testings... I hope you have or will participate in their testing next time to see for yourself where darkcoin is going and get some understanding, you don't have to be technical as I am not. And you will get to know your devs better, I hope.
I am not sure what you are reading, I just translate this for you one more time
There is no "gimme gimme" in my posts
it is about
Communication !
(pm me if you wanna discuss this further)
moli
Well-known member
I'm not sure what you mean about "communication". What more do you expect from the darkcoin team? Everything is available to find on DCT and Jira. It's not that hard to read through these resources. If you want to know more about Darksend, do some testing. Testnet is still open. Have a technical question? Post your question and flare or someone will help you out.
CHAOSiTEC
Official Darkcoin Dev
Everybody, please take a deep breath...
The quest for information, for the sake of information, does not lead to anything, isnt it better to get information WHEN there is something to communicate, alot of stuff happening behind the scenes, that really is just plain boring to the average investor.
Also, i would like anyone that feels development is going slow, to look up "software development captain crunch", in regard to RC4.
Evan is working on this FULL time, he needs to also be able to have a life on the side, he is nobodys slave, besides, its always better to code, when your head is in the right state. He is also spread thin with all the stuff going on "coding, foundation, bug hunting etc"
As in regard to me, i am reading through the code, to get to know the "beast", working on odd jobs and trying out ideas... it takes time to get into things...
take a deep breath, get outside, enjoy a night out with your wife, just as we deserve to be able to do the same...
And remember, we are working toward Release Version 1 - all good things comes to he who waits...
This thirst for new stuff, new feature news news news is crazy, look at bitcoin, how often do they release new info... what about peercoin, vertcoin litecoin etc...
CHAOSiTEC
The quest for information, for the sake of information, does not lead to anything, isnt it better to get information WHEN there is something to communicate, alot of stuff happening behind the scenes, that really is just plain boring to the average investor.
Also, i would like anyone that feels development is going slow, to look up "software development captain crunch", in regard to RC4.
Evan is working on this FULL time, he needs to also be able to have a life on the side, he is nobodys slave, besides, its always better to code, when your head is in the right state. He is also spread thin with all the stuff going on "coding, foundation, bug hunting etc"
As in regard to me, i am reading through the code, to get to know the "beast", working on odd jobs and trying out ideas... it takes time to get into things...
take a deep breath, get outside, enjoy a night out with your wife, just as we deserve to be able to do the same...
And remember, we are working toward Release Version 1 - all good things comes to he who waits...
This thirst for new stuff, new feature news news news is crazy, look at bitcoin, how often do they release new info... what about peercoin, vertcoin litecoin etc...
CHAOSiTEC
vertoe
Three of Nine
Just a few notes,
- much like fernando I'm not part of the dev team.
- any comments loaded with too much emotion will be removed, please stay calm and stick to facts.
vertoe
Three of Nine
I think you misunderstood, this is not about releasing more and more stuff and delivering even faster and faster. The development is doing well, we now need to focus on other things as well, securing the network, enforcing masternode payments, writing up documentation, and so on...
I highly respect eduffield for working full time, but if he has no time for all the other stuff, why not delegating to the community? He cant do all on his own for the whole project..
CHAOSiTEC
Official Darkcoin Dev
in regard to enforcement, Evan has already chimed in on this, and it will happen before RC5, but tests still needs to be run to make sure that part works as it should, so that IS coming
the rest, well, right now im at my work (yes i work on a boat with lousy internet and a bandwidth cap) so when i get home i will see if i can whip something more coherent together after talking with everyone else...
the rest, well, right now im at my work (yes i work on a boat with lousy internet and a bandwidth cap) so when i get home i will see if i can whip something more coherent together after talking with everyone else...
JGCMiner
Active member
Which issues have been ignored?
I don't want the dev team taking time to listen to everything that gets suggested as then nothing would get done due to the inefficiency. Nor is it good if the community gets to see behind the curtain. People who want that level of involvement should just petition to join the dev team.
Furthermore, I think the team has been receptive to community input. Off the top of my head I can state that the masternode system (discussion with Anonymint on BCT) and Darksend+ (denominated change discussion on BCT) were direct results of listening to the community.
As it relates to the example given by the OP of the test rollout plan being ignored by Evan -- I actually think that was the best decision as none of the issues had to do with the RC3 to RC4 roll out but with things that would be hard to find on testnet (like the need for higher fees). We can't stay on testnet forever. Also, the wallet corruption thing was mostly just the old libdb version issue which has nothing to due with RC4. (I do feel for the one guy whose coins were unrecoverable due to RC4, but if you can't even send Evan the correct debug file so he can check the issue then who knows what other PEBKAC was involved.)
The software is not bug free, but I personally have used it on mainnet and it does WORK. Squashing bugs is a normal part of software development. Better usability and communication are coming down the road. Let them get the tech right first.
Darkcoin is 8 months old... now is time for patience as it moves out of beta -- not time for panic.
I don't want the dev team taking time to listen to everything that gets suggested as then nothing would get done due to the inefficiency. Nor is it good if the community gets to see behind the curtain. People who want that level of involvement should just petition to join the dev team.
Furthermore, I think the team has been receptive to community input. Off the top of my head I can state that the masternode system (discussion with Anonymint on BCT) and Darksend+ (denominated change discussion on BCT) were direct results of listening to the community.
As it relates to the example given by the OP of the test rollout plan being ignored by Evan -- I actually think that was the best decision as none of the issues had to do with the RC3 to RC4 roll out but with things that would be hard to find on testnet (like the need for higher fees). We can't stay on testnet forever. Also, the wallet corruption thing was mostly just the old libdb version issue which has nothing to due with RC4. (I do feel for the one guy whose coins were unrecoverable due to RC4, but if you can't even send Evan the correct debug file so he can check the issue then who knows what other PEBKAC was involved.)
The software is not bug free, but I personally have used it on mainnet and it does WORK. Squashing bugs is a normal part of software development. Better usability and communication are coming down the road. Let them get the tech right first.
Darkcoin is 8 months old... now is time for patience as it moves out of beta -- not time for panic.
Interesting thread and I agree with all the points of Belstar.
While I am a software developper myself and I understand developping an application is long and tedious (and this one specifically, as it is mighty complex, I really admire Satoshi's work), I don't understand how, even if we are talking about beta software (not marketed as such but let's be honest we barely reached beta status) we can go to production (mainnet) with highly important features not even tested for regression (or not at all like the enforcement). I know testnet is not big enough and not comparable to mainnet in term of what we will see, is that an excuse to not test a feature at all and rush to mainnet while bugs (and not cosmetics ones only) were still discovered on a daily basis on testnet? A bugless software is impossible (even more for distributed data like that) but still I think it could be better.
We (long time believers) know this project is long term and this is a valid argument from people saying: "why the hurry?". But I will say the same to Evan, why the hurry in putting RC1, RC2, RC3 and RC4 on mainnet? Everytime the release was not ready and what 1 or 2 weeks extra of testnet would have cost to Darkcoin?
I like some of the constructive answers here (not quite the ones dismissing or trying to diminish the valid points), and I really would like to be sure the dev team will be up to speed soon enough and that flare QA expertise can gain more momentum (JIRA was a much needed tool and is a blessing). It is good to hear that CHAOSiTEC has the code. What about the others? Hopefully DRKLord is fine and we can also see or hear progress from UI redesign.
I think what we all want is to see that things are improving, I take the post of Belstar in that way. We really don't want Darkcoin to go to waste as it looks promising despite the current flaws (we all see the vision or we would have fled already). But honestly, release after release we keep seeing the same mistakes done and that's hard (for me at least)...
To bring another note to the already long post (sorry...):
There is one thing that I am afraid of at the moment is the masternode payment (I know some masternode owners are worried also).
The feeling if you got many masternode as I do (did..), is that the payment is weird and really not random:
Here is the graph I obtained (was done for RC4 only on 21/08/2014 and I know it should be finetuned, therefore why I didn't publish it back then):
As you can see on the graph:
I know it is a difficult analysis to do and I am not mathematician, so bare with me if this is completly useless data.
As proposed in another thread, all data is available (I can provide with dumps of my database).
Long post already, I better stop.
While I am a software developper myself and I understand developping an application is long and tedious (and this one specifically, as it is mighty complex, I really admire Satoshi's work), I don't understand how, even if we are talking about beta software (not marketed as such but let's be honest we barely reached beta status) we can go to production (mainnet) with highly important features not even tested for regression (or not at all like the enforcement). I know testnet is not big enough and not comparable to mainnet in term of what we will see, is that an excuse to not test a feature at all and rush to mainnet while bugs (and not cosmetics ones only) were still discovered on a daily basis on testnet? A bugless software is impossible (even more for distributed data like that) but still I think it could be better.
We (long time believers) know this project is long term and this is a valid argument from people saying: "why the hurry?". But I will say the same to Evan, why the hurry in putting RC1, RC2, RC3 and RC4 on mainnet? Everytime the release was not ready and what 1 or 2 weeks extra of testnet would have cost to Darkcoin?
I like some of the constructive answers here (not quite the ones dismissing or trying to diminish the valid points), and I really would like to be sure the dev team will be up to speed soon enough and that flare QA expertise can gain more momentum (JIRA was a much needed tool and is a blessing). It is good to hear that CHAOSiTEC has the code. What about the others? Hopefully DRKLord is fine and we can also see or hear progress from UI redesign.
I think what we all want is to see that things are improving, I take the post of Belstar in that way. We really don't want Darkcoin to go to waste as it looks promising despite the current flaws (we all see the vision or we would have fled already). But honestly, release after release we keep seeing the same mistakes done and that's hard (for me at least)...
To bring another note to the already long post (sorry...):
There is one thing that I am afraid of at the moment is the masternode payment (I know some masternode owners are worried also).
The feeling if you got many masternode as I do (did..), is that the payment is weird and really not random:
- Some of my nodes were having up to 3 payments every day for 4 weeks consistently
- Some others nothing AT ALL during the same period
Here is the graph I obtained (was done for RC4 only on 21/08/2014 and I know it should be finetuned, therefore why I didn't publish it back then):
As you can see on the graph:
- The vast majority of the masternodes received 5 or less payments since RC4 went live
- Next group had received between 6 and 9 payments
- And then some lucky masternodes are receiving 18+ payments.
I know it is a difficult analysis to do and I am not mathematician, so bare with me if this is completly useless data.
As proposed in another thread, all data is available (I can provide with dumps of my database).
Long post already, I better stop.
You're doing a better job that I could at expressing my fears about masternode payments elbereth !
All I can do is point to my small group of nodes and say that over approx a month there has been a huge difference in "luck". A quick peek at here http://drk.poolhash.org/ also shows that the consecutive block payment issue is back again despite being closed off on Jira. This in itself means that it is not random variance.
I really think this needs to be a top priority investigation for the dev team. I have been crunching numbers this (GMT+1) morning and for some of my nodes, they are costing more to run on EC2 than they are bringing in. Since RC4, CPU and network utilisation has increased. Imagine what its going to be like when we get greater adoption?
I appreciate that the price of DRK will be key to ROI on masternodes so I'm not going to close them in the short term but masternodes are so critical to Darkcoin that I think these concerns need to stop being dismissed as random variance and properly investigated.
I hope I'm not expressing a very ignorant view here but isn't clarity and stability on the masternode network the most important thing for DRK at the moment in terms of core functionality?
All I can do is point to my small group of nodes and say that over approx a month there has been a huge difference in "luck". A quick peek at here http://drk.poolhash.org/ also shows that the consecutive block payment issue is back again despite being closed off on Jira. This in itself means that it is not random variance.
I really think this needs to be a top priority investigation for the dev team. I have been crunching numbers this (GMT+1) morning and for some of my nodes, they are costing more to run on EC2 than they are bringing in. Since RC4, CPU and network utilisation has increased. Imagine what its going to be like when we get greater adoption?
I appreciate that the price of DRK will be key to ROI on masternodes so I'm not going to close them in the short term but masternodes are so critical to Darkcoin that I think these concerns need to stop being dismissed as random variance and properly investigated.
I hope I'm not expressing a very ignorant view here but isn't clarity and stability on the masternode network the most important thing for DRK at the moment in terms of core functionality?
JGCMiner
Active member
What was not tested? Enforcement wasn't but that is also not "on" on mainnet. DS+ was tested for a month and there still were new issues noticed in a few hours on mainnet. Would another week have made huge difference? What exactly should have been different or tested longer?
Maybe if specific incidents where referenced with a clear statement of how it should have been better then I could understand, but a general statement like "testing needs to be longer" or "we need better teamwork"' is easy to make and doesn't really help.
P.S. The issues with the RC4 MN payments have been acknowledged and Evan has already confirmed on Jira that the old RC3 system will be used for RC5.