Universal Dividend and Web of Trust for Dashcoin

[demo2]

Omg, there's no "future", there's only "present", what already happened and what will yet happen. You are crazy and all you said is nonsense. You are defending theft and backing it up with a full retard nonsense, and yet defending that it last forever. By now I'm just ignoring you. If you want to prove once again the failure of socialism, create your own coin (or fork another coin) and implement this bullshit and we will watch your coin to die, but you are not going to do it with Dash. Bye.

Money is trust. If you get all the money now, future dash users will not trust you and respect you. With your greed you are transforming dash from money it is supposed to be, to become a collective item for old guys, like it is gold, diamonds, bitcoin or stamps.

And future generations are going to bury you, together with your useless and trustless dash. They dont need to steal dash from you, it is simplier for them not to trust it, and this will be the end of dash. Because you decided you dont want to have future, but only present. So the grave is your reward.

But if you finnaly decide to have future (and I want to see it happening in this poll, you can always change your vote) what is the correct thing to be done ?
Because you dont know how the future will be and how many people will arrive in dash, and because it is somehow stupid not to coin dash as long as you can, and because you cannot produce more dash than the one initially decided, you just coin almost all dash now. But then you define a universal dividend and a basic income along with a scheme of Proof-of-Identity (like the WoT or any other), in order to turn dash symmetric in space and time, and that way respect the future.

 

[demo]

This is a message to all of you, who voted NO here.

• TanteStefana
• elbereth
• splawik21
• Lariondos
• tungfa
• yidakee
• UdjinM6
• calnaughtonjnr
• acidburn
• crowning
• Raptor73
• JGCMiner
• AjM
• oaxaca
• TaoOfSatoshi
• bertlebbert
• bandidorl
• studioz
• Jeztah
• balu
• Macrochip
• noobtrader
• Vedran Yoweri
• TroyDASH
• Defacto
• Comodore
• amanda_b_johnson
• chenriquelira
• Otaci

 

[yidakee]

So, essentially, you're saying future potential Dash users are slaves to the system because they're not getting free Dash right now? This space-time assymetry of yours, can it predict future number of users, their Evolution usernames, and or legacy public keys?

That would be a start.

 

[noobtrader]

your demand is so absurd, you basically want everyone who open Dash wallet to get free coin ???
btw i think this is maybe a good idea, implement faucet in Dash wallet ???

 

[tungfa]

we need a ignore feature here.
Edit: found it

there is one
and it work VERY well

 

[yidakee]

we need a ignore feature here.
Edit: found it

Where ? I feel kinda silly I can't find it

 

[tungfa]

Where ? I feel kinda silly I can't find it

Silly Billy
(so i happy i can finally say that to somebody, normally moo cow said it to me ... lol)

 

[yidakee]

Can I ignore myself @tungfa?

 

[tungfa]

Can I ignore myself @tungfa?

definately that's what I am doing

 

[yidakee]

definately that's what I am doing

Ignoring yourself, or ignoring me?

 

[TheUltraaliens]

Masternodes operators are incentivized

Mining operators are incentivized

This keeps the Dash Network operational 'from block-to-block' and does not guarantee it's future use.

How do you guarantee Dash Networks continual future use? You make the Dash Networks most "Basic" primal function 'valuable'.

Creating, Sending and receiving Private Secure messages/transactions faster than the competition.

The Dash Network has accomplished this.

How will Dash Network continue to accomplish this block-to-block? Give work to the masternode/mining operators.

How? Via creating transactions. Who will do this? Dash Network users. Where are they?

They need a reason to trust the Dash Software, install and run it.

Why will they do this? Because we have fiat gateways? Because they read a paid for article in "Wall Street Journal", " BraveNewCoin", "reddit"?

This does not work. If it did "Bitcoin" would be "The One". (We are seven years in)

Dash Network requires something "Black Swan" to stand out now.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_income

"Dash Network not only rewards masternode and mining operators but now incentives it's active users who can prove adding additional value to the Dash Network"

The additional value could be social network outreach, introducing new users, video bloggs, blogs, art, music, sports sponsorship (Doge NASCAR).

Et cetera....

And for the users outreach they receive a "Basic Income", "Universal Credit", "Universal Dividend" or some magnetic phrase.

Should a user wish to "Pay-It-Forward" into a Dash Network User Outreach Fund, so be it. This fund will attract new users and Network Operators.

Maybe one day "in the future" a line on you resumè might read....

"2018-2022 - Dash Network Operator"
"2017-2018 - Dash Network Outreach"


Back in a Dash

@TheUltraaliens

 

[demo]

This space-time assymetry of yours, can it predict future number of users, their Evolution usernames, and or legacy public keys?

I told you, you need a proof-of-individuality scheme in order to implement a basic income.

This is either the Web-Of -Trust or you can use public keys issued by the states to their citizents.

For example in EU, there is a law and every citizen can ask a public key from its EU state. So you can use that key to prove the individuality, in order to give a basic income in dash.

Here is a list of states that issue digital credentials, that can be used by dash as proof of individuality.

Proof of individuality can be used not only to provide a basic income, but also to give voting rights.

 

[yidakee]

I told you, you need a proof-of-individuality scheme in order to implement a basic income.

This is either the Web-Of -Trust or you can use public keys issued by the states to their citizents.

For example in EU, there is a law and every citizen can ask a public key from its EU state. So you can use that key to prove the individuality, in order to give a basic income in dash.

Here is a list of states that issue digital credentials, that can be used by dash as proof of individuality.

Proof of individuality can be used not only to provide a basic income, but also to give voting rights.

@demo,

I think it has become quite clear that you have presented your thoughts but have gained absolutely zero traction or interest by the community. While you're obviously quite passionate about your views, maybe you should consider another project that might best be suited for your views?

For instance Auroracoin did an actual distribution to all the citizens of Iceland, based on their social security (or was it ID?) number. Maybe look for something similar? Lots of coins out there.

Dash is all about the exact opposite of what you want. We don't want Proof of Individuality, we want Privacy and Anonymity. Individuality is the opposite, and the issuance of credentials, in our project, is absurd.

With Evo, people will secure a username, not in the form of a proovable credential/identity, but in a form of self-secured ownership, just like private-keys, which can be concealed at will and remain private and anonymous. So maybe it's a good time to ponder if this is the right place for your efforts? I'm absolutely sure you'd gain a lot more following in other projects.

Have you considered that? What exactly attracts you to Dash, if all we represent goes agains everything you believe in? We don't believe in free money, basic income, voting-rights-for-the-masses, credentials and/or proof of individuality.

We're working on Privacy, Proof of Service, "Web-of-Trustless" existence, incetivised hard-work, and meritocratic / stake weighted voting distribution.

Does that make sense? We all agree you don't like it, but it's what we're building.

.

 

[demo]

@demo,
I think it has become quite clear that you have presented your thoughts but have gained absolutely zero traction or interest by the community. While you're obviously quite passionate about your views, maybe you should consider another project that might best be suited for your views?
For instance Auroracoin did an actual distribution to all the citizens of Iceland, based on their social security (or was it ID?) number. Maybe look for something similar? Lots of coins out there. Dash is all about the exact opposite of what you want. We don't want Proof of Individuality, we want Privacy and Anonymity. Individuality is the opposite, and the issuance of credentials, in our project, is absurd.

With Evo, people will secure a username, not in the form of a proovable credential/identity, but in a form of self-secured ownership, just like private-keys, which can be concealed at will and remain private and anonymous. So maybe it's a good time to ponder if this is the right place for your efforts? I'm absolutely sure you'd gain a lot more following in other projects.

Have you considered that? What exactly attracts you to Dash, if all we represent goes agains everything you believe in? We don't believe in free money, basic income, voting-rights-for-the-masses, credentials and/or proof of individuality.

We're working on Privacy, Proof of Service, "Web-of-Trustless" existence, incetivised hard-work, and meritocratic / stake weighted voting distribution.

Does that make sense? We all agree you don't like it, but it's what we're building.

.

First of all, you are not working really hard on privacy, anonymity e.t.c. Many of you, you dont give a penny about anonymity and privacy...

Why I am in dash? because I like anonymity and democracy. But at the same time I like basic income and symmetry in space-time, and I want to respect future generations.

In order to have a basic income, a proof of individuality is required, but a proof of individuality is not necessarily against anonymity and privacy. You may of course use state's issued credentials to provide a basic income, but if you are in favor of anonymity, you may not used them and find other ways.

A web-of-trust can be used to prove individuality, while respecting anonymity at the same time.

Additionally cryptoparty assemblies can be used, in order to prove individuality whithout revealing identity. There is a scheme where people participate (bodily, physically) in a cryptoparty, and they put their public keys (printed in QR code) inside a physical ballot box. Then the ballot box opens, we count that the persons that participated are equal to the number of public keys extracted from the physical ballot box, everybody agrees that his public key is inside the list of public keys, and this list of public keys can be used for now on as a proof of individuality, while preserving anonymity at the same time. And of course a web of trust among those assemblies can also be established.

So there are solutions if we want to have anonymity, privacy, democracy, proof-of-individuality and basic income at the same time. Thats why I am here, I am trying to join anonymity and privacy (dash's goals) and democracy (dash tends to it) with space-time symmetry and basic income (which you now detest, but future dash generation I hope they won't).

 

[yidakee]

@demo

Ok dude, whatever.

By the way, this is a message from some intergalactic space travelling buddies of mine. They came to me in a lucid dream and specifically asked me relay this message to you. They're from the future.

 

[yidakee]

So as not to be completely impolite with the OP, and being a physics lover, I'll be munching on this tonight to figure if there is any way quantum physics can generate free money without collapsing an economy, society in general and collective and individual human motivation.

Maybe turn the CERN into a mega mining machine and use dark matter as the algo?

If I manage it, I promise to call the tokens Banana Bosons

 

[demo]

So as not to be completely impolite with the OP, and being a physics lover, I'll be munching on this tonight to figure if there is any way quantum physics can generate free money without collapsing an economy, society in general and collective and individual human motivation.

Of course when everybody generates money, the economy collapses.

The universal dividend is not about everybody to produce money. The universal dividend to have meaning it requires everybody to trust one type of money, and of course the total number of coins of this money should remain stable.

But then we have to redistribute this money, in order to be fair and respect the future generations, that were not living or were not aware whenever the total amount of this money was mined. Those future generations in order to trust this one_and_only money, and do not start producing their own, they must be respected.

The disrespect of the future is the flaw of bitcoin, of dash and of many other cryptocoins of today.

 

[tungfa]

Of course when everybody generates money, the economy collapses.

The universal dividend is not about everybody to produce money.
It is requires everybody to trust one type of money, and of course the total number of coins of this money should remain stable.

But then we have to redistribute this money, in order to be fair and respect the future generations, that were not living or were not aware whenever the total amount of this money was mined. Those future generations in order to trust this one and only money, and do not start producing their own, they must be respected.

man man
everything ever mined is in the code !
there is no hidden blockchain (as other coins have), with Dash everything is transparent as mentioned many of times
the final and present number of coins is accessible, just do your research
(try harder)

 

[demo]

man man
everything ever mined is in the code !
there is no hidden blockchain (as other coins have), with Dash everything is transparent as mentioned many of times
the final and present number of coins is accessible, just do your research
(try harder)

I know that. I know that the final and present number of dash coins is accesible and transparent. This is good. The total number of coins should be stable, in order for the economy to have a scarce value to refer to and to be based on. This is done in dash, and it is a good choice of the core team.

The bad thing is that you mined a lot of dash, and future generations will not have equal chances to mine it. Of course the solution to this problem is not to make mining harder. You dont know how hard mining should be, because you cannot predict how many the newcomers will be. As long as you cannot predict the future, go on and mine almost all dash today, and then implement a basic income (from your budget) and give it to the new users that can prove their individuality, in order to reduce this unfairness.

And I never said how much this basic income should be. I said vote for it, with numbers. So lets do a vote emulation and estimation, based on the spirit of the people who voted here.


How much the basic income should be, as a percentage of the budget?

1. 100% 2 vote(s) 5.7%
2. 50% 0 vote(s) 0.0%
3. 10% 1 vote(s) 2.9%
4. 0% 31 vote(s) 88.6%
5. other 1 vote(s) 2.9%

So the basic income should be (2*100 + 1*10 + 31*0)/34 = 6.17% of the budget.

So if you refuse as a community to be absolute and answering yes/no to the questions, and if you accept accuracy and answering with numbers and voting with numbers, then please commit 6.17% from your budget, and give it to the newcomers who can prove their individuality.

It is a good thing for dash to do this, not a bad thing.

 

[yidakee]

Thank you for the Dumb-bomb @demo - I feel much better now.