March 2016 Budget Proposal
- Thread starter eduffield
- Start date
koampapapa
Member
hi guys, long-time lurker, first-time poster.
I'm wondering if Evan could be referring to a change to a proof-of-stake algorithm, probably using masternodes. The entire masternode system sounds similar to Proof-of-Casper, Ethereum's proof-of-stake algorithm that doesn't exist yet. Basically in PoC a group of nodes each put down 1000 coin, and if they start falsifying transactions, they risk losing that 1000.. This is better than peercoin's proof-of-stake where there's no risk to falsifying transactions. And since masternodes already put down 1000 (in fact, from now on I will describe PoC as a masternode system built on PoS, since the masternodes came first) something like this seems well-suited for Dash's community. If you have no idea what Im garbling on about, this reddit post describes the difference between PoS and PoW pretty well. I can't post links yet though so you'll have to add the reddit domain before it /r/Bitcoin/comments/3xafis/marc_andreessen_big_companies_desperately_hoping/cy7hj0j
The reason it can't be a simple rotating door of PoW is that no crypto can really scale with a PoW algorithm. PoW uses too much energy for it to be a useful worldwide currency, and probably won't scale for processing transactions at a super fast rate. For the fastest transaction times + limited energy wastage + after following Evan's ingenuity for several months, I'm guessing there will be either a proof-of-stake switch, or some kind of masternode/proof-of-stake hybrid, to be put on the roadmap for two years from now. It also explains why he would "hint' at something and give a bunch of reasons for it without saying what it was, so as not to disturb the waters in this precious Oasis.
And no, though I'm a new account, i'm not a paid shill or whatever. i dont know what my angle would be if i was even. i bought in at $2.20, kept about 700 dash for a bit, sold it earlier this week. However, after reading this announcement, am probably going to half my Ethereum balance to run a masternode or two. I live a double life as a speculator andfrom a price standpoint, a PoS announcement would definitely drive in speculation. Glad I got here first.
I'm wondering if Evan could be referring to a change to a proof-of-stake algorithm, probably using masternodes. The entire masternode system sounds similar to Proof-of-Casper, Ethereum's proof-of-stake algorithm that doesn't exist yet. Basically in PoC a group of nodes each put down 1000 coin, and if they start falsifying transactions, they risk losing that 1000.. This is better than peercoin's proof-of-stake where there's no risk to falsifying transactions. And since masternodes already put down 1000 (in fact, from now on I will describe PoC as a masternode system built on PoS, since the masternodes came first) something like this seems well-suited for Dash's community. If you have no idea what Im garbling on about, this reddit post describes the difference between PoS and PoW pretty well. I can't post links yet though so you'll have to add the reddit domain before it /r/Bitcoin/comments/3xafis/marc_andreessen_big_companies_desperately_hoping/cy7hj0j
The reason it can't be a simple rotating door of PoW is that no crypto can really scale with a PoW algorithm. PoW uses too much energy for it to be a useful worldwide currency, and probably won't scale for processing transactions at a super fast rate. For the fastest transaction times + limited energy wastage + after following Evan's ingenuity for several months, I'm guessing there will be either a proof-of-stake switch, or some kind of masternode/proof-of-stake hybrid, to be put on the roadmap for two years from now. It also explains why he would "hint' at something and give a bunch of reasons for it without saying what it was, so as not to disturb the waters in this precious Oasis.
And no, though I'm a new account, i'm not a paid shill or whatever. i dont know what my angle would be if i was even. i bought in at $2.20, kept about 700 dash for a bit, sold it earlier this week. However, after reading this announcement, am probably going to half my Ethereum balance to run a masternode or two. I live a double life as a speculator andfrom a price standpoint, a PoS announcement would definitely drive in speculation. Glad I got here first.
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Check page 6 and 7. In Evolution miners will select the masternode quorum. The new system will be called Deterministic Proof-of-work.
koampapapa
Member
Thank you for not berating me for not doing my homework (I do have real homework to do, sadly...). Can I ask what necessary role does Satoshi's PoW play in the design? But first, let me make sure this is how it works:
Third tier: Transactions between end-users are relayed to nodes and masternodes
Second tier: Transactions between masternodes are relayed to miners. Also, masternodes store other people's data (? -- this was new to me, what have you guys been up to in the last few months? Incredible)
First tier: Miners verify transactions using PoW.
Is this correct? Is it necessary to separate the first and second tier?
While I don't think it's wise to simply copy Ethereum's model (although really, Dash could implement something like it extremely easily), I'm not sure the benefits of PoW outweigh the benefits of a modified PoS algorithm. I just am not learned enough to know whether Dash will be able to scale with this set-up, is there any data or an ELI5 for why this will work?
Third tier: Transactions between end-users are relayed to nodes and masternodes
Second tier: Transactions between masternodes are relayed to miners. Also, masternodes store other people's data (? -- this was new to me, what have you guys been up to in the last few months? Incredible)
First tier: Miners verify transactions using PoW.
Is this correct? Is it necessary to separate the first and second tier?
While I don't think it's wise to simply copy Ethereum's model (although really, Dash could implement something like it extremely easily), I'm not sure the benefits of PoW outweigh the benefits of a modified PoS algorithm. I just am not learned enough to know whether Dash will be able to scale with this set-up, is there any data or an ELI5 for why this will work?
Not quite, In Evolution, the plan was (I say was because I think they're up to something???) to have the miners come up with a hash, from that hash, quorums would be created (10 MNs in each quorum) and those would lock all transactions. Miners would then bundle all the transactions approved by the MNs (locked) into a block. They can not put anything that hasn't first been locked by masternodes into the block or else it would be rejected. Because quarums can lock transactions quickly, all transactions will be instant.
On the other side of the DAPI, wallets access the MN network through some gateway, this gateway hides the user's IP address from the MNs. Because of this, the mixing of funds is done by blinded masternodes. I also think they found a way to mix funds quickly and randomly? There is something in the works here I don't know about.
The wallet ID has access to it's files which are stored on the MN network's sharded storage (redundant) So the user can open their wallet with name and password from any device, and they will always see the same thing. They will see their friends network, their transaction history, etc... and all their keys will always be there. Although they should never have to worry about backing up their wallet, I believe the plan is to make it so people can back up all their own information on their own device or set up a cloud account to back it up in. This is one more redundancy to ensure nothing is ever lost. The only data stored on the network, though, is user data, account data, transaction data, ratings, and keys (I think they're deterministic keys)
koampapapa
Member
I thought the plan was to develop all this out in the open. Whatever they make is going to be flawed unless they develop it step by step with the community i.e. through this governance thing
From past experience, Evan comes up with an idea, then fleshes it out before presenting it to everyone. At that point it's usually profound and we all want it, but if it's not a good idea, we can always reject it 