Dash needs new leadership and direction

I love his arguments :D

Btw demo, there's an actually awesome South Park episode (S01E09) about what happens when everybody's idea counts. Go watch it, I bet you'll find it more enjoyable than reading those complicated papers.

@kot Do you see any value in creating a code of conduct-like onepager about how contributions are welcome in the project?
 
balu said:
I love his arguments :D

Btw demo, there's an actually awesome South Park episode (S01E09) about what happens when everybody's idea counts. Go watch it, I bet you'll find it more enjoyable than reading those complicated papers.

@kot Do you see any value in creating a code of conduct-like onepager about how contributions are welcome in the project?
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No - this is an open-source project.
Everyone is welcome to contribute or use it (or stop using if don't like it). It should not be regulated by any code of conduct in my opinion.
 
demo said:
It is not the theory you discovered in interet, that happens to have the same name I just coined.
Maybe I have to change the name again. I dont care about names, meaning is what matters.
Click to expand...

This answer really qualifies you.
"Ignore-list symmetry in space-time" applies. If you don't know what "Ignore-list symmetry in space-time" is , it means that not only did you happen to end in my ignore-list, but future generations will have the same amount of work to put you there.
Have fun talking to yourself. Bye!
 
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balu said:
I love his arguments :D

Btw demo, there's an actually awesome South Park episode (S01E09) about what happens when everybody's idea counts. Go watch it, I bet you'll find it more enjoyable than reading those complicated papers.
Click to expand...


I think people in the South Park episode (S01E09) didnt have a system like that:
demo said:
Should we go to France? Yes/No/Other
|________result No/Other----> end
|________result Yes---> Should we go by plane? Yes/No/Other
|________result Yes---> Should we stay in a Hotel? Yes/No/Other
|________result Yes-----> In a double room? Yes/No/Other​
From that tree of polls, the specs will be extracted automatically, according to the votes of the people.
Click to expand...

I already asked you if you want me to implement it here, in order to produce the specifications that community as a whole desires to be writen in code. A constitution of what code should be written. For the new age to arrive, the age where the coder king will bow down to the will of the community.

But you didnt answer to me.
 
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Ah, so back-edited your comments, had to read them again.

But you're lack of reading skills is amazing.

Let me quote it again for you what I wrote:
"If you have nothing at stake, your opinion weights less than that of those who are invested somehow. Deal with it."

Which you interpreted as: "So theories have no value at all?"

If you feel like people are not giving your ideas the desired attention - which is the case apparently - you have two options:
- bitch about it in a topic like this, which will not change things in your favor, I assure you
- act upon it, either by sending in pull requests, creating a detailed proposal, or investing financially and thereby influencing the project

I'm eager to see your executable, detailed plans.
 
balu said:
I'm eager to see your executable, detailed plans.
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Actually the only thing needed is a directory tree structure, in order to hang the polls on it.
This can be done, for demonstration purposes, even here, in this forum, in a special place of course, so we will not bother the normal forum operation.

This of course requires to give people the right to create topics in this special place. Topics, having a tree-directory structure, that can emulate how comes and polls are dependant eachother. Meaning a poll's existance is dependant on the result of a previous poll.

By the way, I like very much your new rating system in posts! Good job! :)
 
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raganius said:
@GrandMasterDash I respect and admire you, as you've always been an important and sensible member of this community. Your concerns are justifiable and pertinent, and very opportune.

DASH is changing a lot. And I have been feeling quite uncomfortable with it. Not because of the changes in itself, but because of a strange sensation that the community is falling appart.

I know that Evan is faithful to the community, and I am sure that he is doing his best for DASH. The only failure, in my opinion, is "distance": It feels like Evan keeps himself "distanced" from us. I am not sure if "distanced" is the correct word here, but what I mean is that Evan is not "present" (ostensive).

At first it was ok, as the community used to be much more harmonious (maybe homogeneous), was smaller... DASH was "smaller". But now, many things are happening at the same time, some things are good, some not so much, and the community has developed, and now it is much more complex. Fights are becoming frequent (and that is normal in a complex community).

Evan's lack of "direct contact" with the community causes a great deal of anxiety, as we remain "blind" (not knowing what is going on).
Click to expand...

I get the same feeling the community is falling apart.
At the moment it feels like Evan is being surrounded by the core team and nobody else knows what's going on. But I also think it might be unavoidable since this project has become much bigger than it was in the past and there is no way he can be reading the forums daily and respond to people. Even if he does, it's up to him what he wants to do or not, while not coding.

Unfortunately we are in the situation where the Open Source philosophy meets the world of money and business. It's not an easy one to digest. We all have invested our money in the project, hence we feel we can require stuff to be implemented or not. On the other hand it's Evan who leads the project and you simply can't tell him to code something he does not want to implement. So I think at this point our only choices here are to sell our investment if we don't like it anymore or trust the team and watch closely how it unfolds.
Alternatively if we don't like what members of the Core Team are doing and we have some skills then we can simply start doing it better. Nobody will forbid me to start promoting dash, right? Or start working on a better wallet design (no offence crowning.) Nobody chose these guys to do what they do, they just want to do it.

Sadly we are not in a position to tell our coders what to do. Not yet. So my question is what happens when the project gets much bigger? Big enough to be able to pay the developers a full salary? Will voting be the only decision maker? Or would that still be Evan and the core team?
 
@jpr

The community is not falling apart. Yes there may be a few voices of dissent, which is natural as we are all humans (except maybe a cyborg or two?).

Evan is creating his ideas, and people recognise it and contribute. Core team or core devs do not have structural decision making, they're just following a development roadmap put in place. Just following the lead of the visionary founder of the project. That's it.

And what you say is quite right! Everyone is welcome to do better in any area they feel they're an added value.

.
 
jpr said:
I get the same feeling the community is falling apart.
At the moment it feels like Evan is being surrounded by the core team and nobody else knows what's going on. But I also think it might be unavoidable since this project has become much bigger than it was in the past and there is no way he can be reading the forums daily and respond to people. Even if he does, it's up to him what he wants to do or not, while not coding.

Unfortunately we are in the situation where the Open Source philosophy meets the world of money and business. It's not an easy one to digest. We all have invested our money in the project, hence we feel we can require stuff to be implemented or not. On the other hand it's Evan who leads the project and you simply can't tell him to code something he does not want to implement. So I think at this point our only choices here are to sell our investment if we don't like it anymore or trust the team and watch closely how it unfolds.
Alternatively if we don't like what members of the Core Team are doing and we have some skills then we can simply start doing it better. Nobody will forbid me to start promoting dash, right? Or start working on a better wallet design (no offence crowning.) Nobody chose these guys to do what they do, they just want to do it.

Sadly we are not in a position to tell our coders what to do. Not yet. So my question is what happens when the project gets much bigger? Big enough to be able to pay the developers a full salary? Will voting be the only decision maker? Or would that still be Evan and the core team?
Click to expand...

This makes no sense to me. First off, there are only a few people who are clueless as to what the Dash project is, and always has been since the start - which is Evan's vision to create an easy to use cash replacement. Evan has given us everything he plans on doing, as clear as he can make it, and even updates us when he changes his mind and comes up with something better. The direction AND the plan have been made perfectly clear. All they (the core team) are doing now is putting in the sweat to make it happen. Most of us (95% or more) understand this. There is nothing wrong with bringing up issues if you see a problem, or give out ideas, but if it's not working within the vision, and trust me, my ideas have been put down many times, then we must accept that it won't work or causes too many problems.

RE: complaints I see on the forums:

We need to be mature about having our ideas rejected, or even not heard because Evan can't respond to everyone anymore. As an example, I was seriously in love with some of my ideas and bugged everyone about them for quite some time, but in the end, I realized the team was RIGHT, and I was wrong. But I bugged 'em respectfully, maybe I whined a little (Oh, I wish you could please....) but never got in their face because I didn't like being told no.

Ideas are welcome, but when they're rejected, one has to accept it. If one doesn't like it, one can go fork the project and do it their own way. There is nothing wrong with that, after all, it's the whole point of Open Source Projects. :)

As far as the core team goes, they belong to Evan. Until the majority of share holders (MN owners) decide they don't want Evan anymore, and fire his team, Evan gets to decide who he wants to pay for their work and who he wants on his team, and we have nothing to say about it. Because in the end, Evan et al, are contractors for Dash, just like any other contractor who has made a proposal. And frankly, I think they've been doing an amazing job, so I'm not about to promote firing them. No way!
 
I just want to say I FULLY support Evan and the core team. They have shown great leadership and talent.

This thread is crazy, I'm not sure why people are even responding to the trolling, it just encourages them.

Pablo.
 
My son plays Little League baseball, and he is quite enthusiastic about it. To be honest, so am I. Last year he was in an important tournament and his coach made a number of decisions that I thought were ill-conceived and led to the team losing a tournament they should have won. Most of the decisions involved not playing my son as I thought he should be played. I'll admit that I was pretty upset about it (if you don't have kids or aren't involved in sports, you might not understand how intense it gets).

However, I said nothing to the coach about it, and thanked him for his hard work. Why? Because if I had a problem with how the coaching was done, I can just start my own team and be the coach. Since I didn't put the time and effort into being the coach, I frankly didn't have the right to criticize what he was doing. If he asked me my opinion, I would have respectfully given it to him, but since he didn't, I kept my mouth shut.

Take this story and apply it however you wish to this situation. :)
 
I've had many many MANY fantastic and wonderful ideas through the years. I've proposed them, nagged a little to have me heard.

Some seem as "simple" as pie, but impossible to implement (or were at the time, probably still are). I don't think any of my ideas ever got implemented, some quite "brilliant" if you ask me (because I am me, so I'm entitled), like incentivised P2pool mining, or File - Open - wallet-with-different-name-structure.dat ... or and 95% trustless pooled masternode system, numerous others, and this or that... Zero were implemented.

Yet, I don't let my ego get the best of me. This is not "my" project because it's open-source and a DAO.

.
 
TanteStefana said:
This makes no sense to me. First off, there are only a few people who are clueless as to what the Dash project is, and always has been since the start - which is Evan's vision to create an easy to use cash replacement. Evan has given us everything he plans on doing, as clear as he can make it, and even updates us when he changes his mind and comes up with something better. The direction AND the plan have been made perfectly clear. All they (the core team) are doing now is putting in the sweat to make it happen. Most of us (95% or more) understand this. There is nothing wrong with bringing up issues if you see a problem, or give out ideas, but if it's not working within the vision, and trust me, my ideas have been put down many times, then we must accept that it won't work or causes too many problems.

RE: complaints I see on the forums:

We need to be mature about having our ideas rejected, or even not heard because Evan can't respond to everyone anymore. As an example, I was seriously in love with some of my ideas and bugged everyone about them for quite some time, but in the end, I realized the team was RIGHT, and I was wrong. But I bugged 'em respectfully, maybe I whined a little (Oh, I wish you could please....) but never got in their face because I didn't like being told no.

Ideas are welcome, but when they're rejected, one has to accept it. If one doesn't like it, one can go fork the project and do it their own way. There is nothing wrong with that, after all, it's the whole point of Open Source Projects. :)

As far as the core team goes, they belong to Evan. Until the majority of share holders (MN owners) decide they don't want Evan anymore, and fire his team, Evan gets to decide who he wants to pay for their work and who he wants on his team, and we have nothing to say about it. Because in the end, Evan et al, are contractors for Dash, just like any other contractor who has made a proposal. And frankly, I think they've been doing an amazing job, so I'm not about to promote firing them. No way!
Click to expand...

Even if the majority of shareholders (Masternodes) decided they don't want Evan, all they can do is stop him from getting funded. His team would still be his team and if they wanted to keep working on DASH without getting blockchain funding, there is nothing that could stop them, the "governance" ( or lack thereof) over protocol updates and how they propagate would be essentially the same as Bitcoin and other coins.
 
"Dash needs new leadership and direction"

I totally disagree, and frankly i find the title of this thread very arrogant of nature. If OP is really that upset with the
direction that Dash is going then maybe it is time for OP to re-evaluate his involvement with Dash.
 
I would just like to say I had nothing to do with this thread, but I'm personally quite thankful for it. It took the heat off of me quite nicely, and here I agree with @kot, @yidakee, and @crowning.

Our system is not perfect, no system is. But this thread will accomplish nothing.
 
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